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Discussion: E

in: billh; billh > 2016-06-16

Jun 16, 2016 6:19 PM # 
That 80/20 thing. Just got to get out early and get the mileage in. Commute run for me would be too long at this point in the training so it's all from home. And, with it so hot, I don't really want to do more than 8 at a time, it takes me too long to recover.
Jun 16, 2016 8:30 PM # 
I'm in a bad rut of getting minor strains during the JD Q workouts that take me a couple days to recover and prevent me from putting in the E miles, so have to rely on biking for the easy efforts . . . forging ahead with JD Phase 3 which is the toughest phase, only made it to Week 3 last time before getting too sick/ injured/ fatigued to continue. I'm in Week 2 now, so this is a critical time and appears still can't handle it.
Jun 16, 2016 9:50 PM # 
matzah ball:
Maybe pull the plug and start over. No point in doing intervals and speedwork w no running base - too much stress, not enough built up strength. Build a strong foundation w quality pace running.
Jun 16, 2016 10:16 PM # 
i agree. build a solid base of E and then reintroduce T, I, and R workouts after you've got a good base.
Jun 16, 2016 11:04 PM # 
I thought I had a good base! I was up to 30 mpw in the May leadup to STL senior games on Mem Day. Is it possible to lose base in three weeks?

That said, I'd be happy not to go through JD Phase 3 right now. Really not up for it in this heat. The heat deserves its own Phase. JD Phase Heat. I guess I'd rather do JD Phase 1 in the heat than JD Phase 3. . . .

Maybe I was not doing my E miles fast enough. Could try another base phase with faster base miles. Never did figure out the proper pace for E runs. because VDOT drops so far in Phase 1, it seemed the pace for an "old" VDOT, based on a PR months earlier, was too fast. But then if use the current VDOT, then the E pace is too slow to support Phase 2. ??? I'm confused.
Jun 16, 2016 11:48 PM # 
matzah ball:
It looks like in April, for instance, you were averaging 20 miles a week, but a lot of that said 'walk/run' or 'E' w a recorded pace of 16-18 minute miles, so it was not clear how many miles you were really running at pace, say 9-10 min. miles?

Or in May your log lists 94 miles of E, R, and Walk/Run which would be 23.5 miles average per week, but even the R is listed at 13.5 min per mile pace...and all the rest at 16. If its that slow, it doesnt count. Or if it includes breaks etc.the breaks dont count. Sorry! It's all right there in your AP log:)

Re-set, ramp up and race in Illinois senior games sept. 26 in Springfield? Once you get fit, amazing things will start to happen.
Jun 17, 2016 3:29 AM # 
some of that is I hate the auto turn-off feature on the Garmin so the clock is running at stop lights, eg. Jackson and Laclede Station is a long light. which makes the mph slower. I dunno, I felt like I had the best run base of my life going into the STL games. but obviously not enough. In the big picture, I might be more well served just to take some time off and focus on eating right, nutrition and weight loss. I don't really have it in me to do another JD base run phase right now, not just the boredom, which I think I could overcome, just that I can't bring myself to do it. I feel pretty good on the bike so might train for fall cyclocross season. the failure at the STL games really did a number on my mental game. really, have not digested that and come to terms with that disappointment. really floundering mentally at this point. just have to give it some time until a direction emerges, a light in the darkness. without being too dramatic, haha. how to frame a six month buildup to a single point in time . . . with a terribly disappointing outcome. ??? it will take some time to re-orient. but I agree it's pointless continue to struggle with any vestige of JD Phase 3 or 4 training. In a real sense . . . I'M DONE.
Jun 17, 2016 12:23 PM # 
matzah ball:
and when you're waiting at a light you are not running either. You and the garmin are in some kind of collusion! That's why I don't have one, I suspect they were designed to take people's mind off of the unfolding reality and joy of health and fitness, and make them dependent on tech gadgets to keep their mental equilibrium.

"You're fooling yourself if you don't believe it
You're kidding yourself if you don't believe it
Get up, get back on your feet
You're the one they can't beat and you know it
Come on, let's see what you've got
Just take your best shot and don't blow it"
Jun 17, 2016 1:50 PM # 
I think you can lose a significant amount of base in 3 weeks, enough that 2 or 3 E weeks before any serious R or I workouts would be a good idea.

Doing the same run every day would get old, fast. But, there are plenty of places to do an E run w/o lights. A lap around FP in the morning or at lunch. Or grants trail. The AA5k route. I've got a 9-10 mile route through WG and I don't think there're any lights, well, maybe one crossing Elm, but not usually a problem.

Build some base AND "focus on eating right, nutrition and weight loss".
Jun 17, 2016 2:11 PM # 
matzah ball:
trails. parks
Jun 17, 2016 2:51 PM # 
let's say the E runs were in the 10-11 range . . . while running. that probably corresponds to a VDOT for a 6:01 1500 . . . so it really all does fit together. I think the interpretation is probably not "run your E runs faster", it's probably just work the program so that VDOT increases, which in turn means the VDOT can support faster E runs and race times.

I actually liked the double commute to metro and back. hit two parks, Blackburn and Weiner, got to run fast down some hills. it was just too tiring leading up to a race. then after racing, felt too tired to resume. then got on the injured treadmill due to loss of base! I guess the answer is just to rebuild the base. as far as weight, I think I could be a lot more competitive without the proverbial "extra 10 lbs", sort of a "race weight #1" where I know I can be satisfied with the times. but to get there is not easy. I may revisit the Precision Nutrition folks and even consider some nutrition coaches. did it last time just with the mail order materials and online support.

appreciate the feedback, it helps. the future is not so grim as I thought. lots of options. and it is "all good".

ps--just plugged my armed forces 5K 23:44 into the JD vdot calculator and comes out vdot=40 . . . which corresponds to an equivalent race time of 1M of 7:01 or 1500 of 6:30. so really the 6:01 was punching above my weight, so to speak. which also jives with the Riverfront 1M of 6:5x. the numbers really line up, just they are not what I wanted after 6 mo of training. I still have to go back to body weight as the major factor. I think I built a base equivalent to my vdot back then, which was in the 46 range after frostbite. at probably 5 lbs lighter.

the major question I have is why after six month of JD, why did my vdot drop by six points from 46 to 40? maybe I have chronic fatigue syndrome?

pps--PN is $99 per month for online nutrition coaching . . .
Jun 17, 2016 3:55 PM # 
extra weight = lower vdot. if you really did drop from 46 to 40 vdot over the 6 months despite training, I'd be looking for other factors. any other cardiac health risk factors? had any blood tests done recently?
Jun 17, 2016 4:09 PM # 
matzah ball:
$99 a month will buy a whole lot of fresh, sustainable, vegetarian food w some organic yogurt and eggs thrown in...
Jun 17, 2016 5:59 PM # 
I could spend $49 on organic veggies and the remaining $50 to mb to motivate me!

one of the exercises they do for PN coaching is to take weekly front back and side pics in speedos and send them to the coach, but you have to sign away permission for PN to use them for publicity. it's supposed to be an exercise in body image, but sounds like self-humiliation. I'm not that desperate . . . yet.

I think I'm only 5 lb heavier now than last Dec, though I do feel much more fatigue. maybe some weird infection. my brother has chronic/ adrenal fatigue, just wiped him out. he can't even run at all.
Jun 17, 2016 7:21 PM # 
I had a tick-borne thing that totally wiped me out for a loonnng time. One of the side effects was sleep apnea. Did a year with a cpap machine. Luckily the apnea subsided to 'normal' levels and I got to dump the cpap.

i am not *ever* planning to send speedo selfies to anyone. especially if there's a risk of publication.
Jun 17, 2016 8:50 PM # 
here's examples of pics . . . I mean, some of these transformations are impressive . . .
Jun 17, 2016 9:37 PM # 
i'm not sure i want to look at that..... actually, i'm pretty sure i don't. :)
Jun 17, 2016 10:59 PM # 
haha, some things you can't "unsee" . . .

This discussion thread is closed.