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Discussion: Babes?

in: chitownclark; chitownclark > 2016-12-03

Dec 3, 2016 1:09 PM # 
JanetT:
I thought that's what Sports Illustrated was for.

As much as T would like to make it otherwise, this is a diverse country, not a white male one. All people deserve respect, not just rich billionaires. Knowing Evalin, I'm sure she would appreciate being recognized more for her athleticism than her appearance.
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Dec 3, 2016 1:45 PM # 
matzah ball:
I used to yell 'looking good' at women at running events (in my defense, men too). Just lately I've realized to my horror that these women have likely often been subjected to unwanted remarks about their appearance while running, and hear something completely different than my intention. I meant to be encouraging - 'you are a good runner, w/ good form and perseverance, congratulations' - they quite possibly thought - 'omg not another creep, why here'. (there are many alternatives, most unfortunately very cliched - the best course maybe just to clap and say yay). So I agree w Janet, respect entails not only good intentions, but making sure those good intentions will be understood as such. Can be so very difficult, I can attest to that.
Dec 3, 2016 1:57 PM # 
chitownclark:
Hi Janet. Is that what we're calling our President-elect now? I think we owe him a more respectful address....Mr T?

Don't know Evalin, nor her athletic accomplishments. But I do know her parents slightly. And I think that Joe would be ok that his daughter looked good, and yes sexy, on the cover of O/NA.

For too long O in the US has been most popular with old folks. Kids not so much. A significant contrast to O in Nordic countries, where O meets are a mass of youthful intrigue, competition, and friendships.

While I was VP of CAOC we would see Nordic families move to the area, and bring their kids to our meets...initially. Those kids would, in turn, begin to bring their new American friends to our meets, so they'd have kids their own age to compete with. And I personally tried to involve these families in our club by creating a 'kids club' and special ski events, and ski weekends up north.

But it never worked. Not once. Don't really know why. But my suspicion is that for a kid, US orienteering is obviously of, by and for old people. And it is not cool. It is not fun. And it is not sexy.

I think there are a few kids that are seeing that O/NA cover, and perhaps changing their mind about O right now...
Dec 3, 2016 2:39 PM # 
JanetT:
@matzah ball "looking good" is a good encouragement for runners; "looking strong" would be better.

@chitown... T is my way of alluding to him.

Lots of Nordic (Ameican citizens living abroad) kids on the US JWOC team too...or didn't you notice?

The problem with getting more young people out to O is too much competition with other sports and the advent of video games. The junior team coach is doing a wonderful job at increasing teamwork among the JDT and JNT and doing the best job he possibly can to increase the appeal. But until we have some kind of national support (government sports funding like many other countries have) O will remain on the sidelines.

"Babe" is an appropriate name to call your wife. (Or a certain book/movie pig.)
Dec 3, 2016 4:13 PM # 
matzah ball:
I call my friends beagle 'babe' sometimes:). Thanks, Janet, I like 'looking strong' - why didnt i think of that. Chi, I think you may touching on something deeper in our national psyche - the bias of our society toward all things young. Young people are considered attractive and relevant, old people often not so much, transcending gender lines.
Dec 3, 2016 4:58 PM # 
chitownclark:
Don't know about that. Nothing less attractive than a gawky, awkward, pimply-faced teenage boy...no matter how young!

And Janet, I'm sure you've read dozens of stories about your 'T' since the election. This one explains it all.

I'm encouraged by the success of our juniors. But somehow that is not translating out here to the boondocks. We still have few kids at our meets, even if the parents are coming alone.

But if you and Donna, our two most significant publicists, continue to promote our juniors, and change the negative image of O, perhaps there is hope for the future of US orienteering after the current generation of leaders reaches their dotage. :-)
Dec 5, 2016 3:00 PM # 
Soupbone:
I remember that when putting on publicity opportunities for the club, I thought hiring some women wearing sexy clothes would attract more males to club orienteering events. Well we never did it.
Chi town I really cannot say that the cover is sexy by any means. Unless you think O is a sexy sport. Now when I was on the cover of ONA.......

Now if the current cover got you out to our club events, than this would a win win situation!
Dec 5, 2016 3:55 PM # 
coach:
I went back and looked at the ONA covers for the past year.
J/F-JROTC team (all men from what I can tell)
M/A-Clara (F12?) on skis.
M/J- Tyra racing
S/O-Ross running at WOC
Can't find the summer issue, but those are pretty powerful images, no old men, no one just standing around. A quick look of issues in past years turns up similar images for the cover.
Had to go back to J/A 2011 to find a picture of "old man" Balter.

No women in my family would put up with being called babe.
Dec 5, 2016 7:20 PM # 
chitownclark:
Hey! I went to a CAOC event in August. Won my division too! Remember?

I guess I just think that a close-up of a slim, attractive women dressed in O gear, and running hard in competition is sexy. I don't have the inventory of back issues as coach does, but scanning through my pile going back 5-6 years, I see no other cover that appeals as much as Dave Yee's shot of Evalin high-stepping down the finish chute at JWOC. It is a beautifully composed shot, that 'fills the frame' as so few O/NA subjects do: good lighting, great colors, an engaging expression of concentration on her face...all draw you into the photo. An excellent cover! It tells a story~ One that should appeal to anyone, male or female; orienteer or not.

My chief complaint about OUSA publicity is that it seems to be designed to appeal only to OUSA members...not the general public. I'm sure we've all been on the cover at least once; my cover was November 1996, being run-down by Edwin Gookin; Soupbone's cover was a bit better in December 2007, running by himself with a very concerned grimace on his face. But we were both over 50 on those covers! Dedicated but crusty old men! Would anyone pick up those O/NAs from a coffee table rather than Sports Illustrated if given the choice?

Another example: Take a look at the 4 rotating pictures in OUSA's Home page. Lots of people we all know including another crusty old guy with the caption 'Discover a sport of Champions.' But is there anything that would catch the interest, and appeal to a non-orienteer?

Sorry my terminology is offensive to some. But this is my log. And I'm trying to express myself and my feelings as best as I can. 'Babe' and 'sexy' are perfectly acceptable terms in my book, as in 'He/she is a babe!' or He/she looks sexy in that outfit.' They're so much more descriptive than 'She looks nice on that cover' Don't you agree?

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