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Discussion: What do you look for in Retr-O?

in: Orienteering; General

Dec 4, 2016 12:44 PM # 
What is the level of interest in re-running the big oreinteering races of the past?
Me? I love the idea. I have done it twice - a 10 year re-running of the first Canadian Champs and another years ago in Denmark where the race progressed across a map morphing through four different eras of orienteering mapping.
But what about the rest of you? What would you look for in retr-O? The exact original map? the original with essential corrections? the original course on a modern map? A map evolving from 1960s to modern?
Why am I asking? I am staging a re-run of the first Canadian Orienteering championships during next summer's 50th COC week in the Ottawa area. See:
Naturally I would like to make the event as appealing to as many as possible.
I would also like to encourage others to look back as they plan forward.
(Thanks to some great folks at DVOA the original COC course maps have been preserved in mint condition)
Dec 4, 2016 3:55 PM # 
the race progressed across a map morphing through four eras of orienteering mapping.

I remember fondly an event in the Blue Hills south of Boston that progressed across a couple of versions of the map there. Your idea sounds like fun.
Dec 4, 2016 3:59 PM # 
Pick a part of the original map in which the terrain is largely as it was back then, and use that, and bits of more recent maps for other parts of the terrain, on a similar basis. Or whatever; all your ideas sound like fun.
Dec 4, 2016 4:39 PM # 
I wasn't at Camp Fortune in 1968, but I was there in 1998 after the ice storm. The buffet dinner at Camp Fortune at that event was outstanding so one Retro suggestion is to have another buffet dinner there. The Retro-O could then start mid-afternoon to co-ordinate with the dinner.

Different eras of mapping on one course sounds good, better than having the whole thing on the original. Would it all be at the same scale? If so, I would suggest 1:10,000 instead of the 1:20,000 mentioned on the website. Has the vegetation become much different because of the ice storm or has it been reverting back over the past 20 years?

I don't see an actual schedule other than the accommodation/travel indications. However, it doesn't look conducive to doing an easy add-on to the weekend races (e.g., the sprint being on Thursday rather than Friday). So my choice could be either to go for both weekends or to go for the week and find a place to work when I'm not orienteering - I'm already taking a vacation the previous month in Idaho for almost 2 weeks.
Dec 4, 2016 7:45 PM # 
The schedule for the Canada 150 orienteering Festival is on their home page Frankly I'm very excited by this year's schedule. After several years of looking for orienteering opportunites between the weekends next summer I think orienteers will be wondering what to leave out.
I am aware that the Retr-O is the day before the Sprint Championships but with a morning Retr-O and I'm guessing an evening Sprint all should be good. As to your suggestion of a buffet we are looking to do something with Camp Fortune and I would like to invite all who participated in the first COC - that includes at least three still active orienteers - and past COC champs back for a reunion either at the Retr-O or the COC banquet.
The ice storm of '98 is pretty well behind us vegetation-wise.
The 50th re-run will be one map scale and one map but I'm thinking for the future of blended map events IF there is an interest.
Dec 4, 2016 8:31 PM # 
I think the whole point of this would be to provide the authentic experience of running in an orienteering event in the 60s. Therefore, keep the same scale, contours and rock features as in the original map without any corrections and only update paths and vegetation where necessary keeping the same level of accuracy and generalization as in the original map. Of course, use pin punches, rather than SI. Was the course overprinted in 1968 or did the runners have to copy it from the master map? If the latter, make them do the same. Have similar start and finish procedures as back then. Also, suggest that the runners not use thumb compasses and modern o-clothes and shoes :)

Combining maps from different periods is a possibility, but keep sharp boundaries between them instead of gradual blending so people know at all times what year the map they are running on is. One possibility is a map exchange where people start the course, say, on the 60s map and then get a 70s or 80s map in the middle of the course.
Dec 4, 2016 9:15 PM # 
LOL, you just need to go south all the way to GA to run on authentic genuine maps straight from 1970s, and right on the A-meet, with no extra charge.
Add on-demand copying from master map, while on the clock.
Dec 4, 2016 11:43 PM # 
Probably not practical with a 50th anniversary event, but something which was done with the one event of this type I can think of in Australia (a 15th anniversary re-run of the 1976 Australian Championships in 1991) was that you could run either your current class or your 1976 class, and there were good prizes on offer for those who actually ran in 1976 and beat their 1976 time (a few people who were 12s or 14s in 1976 did very nicely out of that). Grant Bluett and I (who were four and five respectively in 1976) were very disappointed that there wasn't a string course.
Dec 5, 2016 1:44 AM # 
At least you could run the string course back then. I'd have needed my mum to run the course for me to have (sort of) completed it.
Dec 5, 2016 3:46 AM # 
RetrO clothing, too? I don't think that any of mine survived. How to make or buy? Do the club colors need to have existed back then? Rip stop nylon, it's been a while. Or perhaps this predates?
Dec 5, 2016 11:19 AM # 
I managed to find some of my old stuff. Also a leather map case and my original super-size sport ident stick. Gosh weren't they clunky.

Dec 6, 2016 1:17 PM # 
I had a bad enough time running at Camp Fortune when the map was a few years old. I can't imagine how bad it would be on map a few decades old.
Dec 6, 2016 5:41 PM # 
What I would look for in any event during a championship week (like the Ottawa O-Fest) is a top notch map, expert course-setting and runnable interesting terrain. Regardless of the history of the event one shouldn't lose sight of those goals at a Canada Cup.
Dec 6, 2016 9:54 PM # 
Pink Socks:
What I would look for in any event during a championship week is a top notch map, expert course-setting and runnable interesting terrain.


I'd also rather that orienteering look to the future instead of the past. What would orienteering look like in 2067? I'd rather run in that event. (If nothing else, it's a good thought experiment that could advance the sport *now* to more people).
Dec 6, 2016 10:02 PM # 
Google Glass displaying the map and course?
Dec 6, 2016 11:23 PM # 
Pink Socks: What would orienteering look like in 2067?

Maybe some sort of silly parkour/urban sprint hybrid, with trashy X-Games judges and Pokémon "CP's".

No thanks...

After recently returning to the sport, there are so many things I miss about 'back in the day'.

I see the sport as a fine wine. I wouldn't mind having a little sip of a quality vintage every once in awhile...
Dec 7, 2016 12:17 AM # 
After recently returning to the sport, there are so many things I miss about 'back in the day'.

Such as?
Dec 7, 2016 3:09 AM # 
.... faded nylon pajamas and duct taped shoes.... oh wait
Dec 7, 2016 3:17 AM # 
Drawing your own course.
Dec 7, 2016 10:59 AM # 
Seeing the IOF MC.
Dec 7, 2016 11:34 AM # 
I guess I had it wrong, with duct taped nylon pyjamas and faded shoes.
Dec 7, 2016 11:44 AM # 
I think there's been a thread on this...

For me, I miss the 'B' meet...or just the opportunity for slightly less formal training...which may include drawing my own map.

(This is probably a regional thing where there seems to be more demand for AR type races than a traditional O-race - which is fair.)

I also miss the 'results clothes line', with stapled, muddied control cards.
Dec 7, 2016 2:19 PM # 
Google Glass? Future? Bwahahahaha!
Dec 9, 2016 4:30 AM # 
We still have a results clothes line for our summer series but we've progressed from staples and now use fancy bulldog clips.
Dec 9, 2016 6:45 AM # 
Oh how cute.

This discussion thread is closed.