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Discussion: Eating Out -- No Guilt!

in: Cristina; Cristina > 2020-03-25

Mar 25, 2020 6:44 PM # 
bbrooke:
Besides helping to keep the restaurants afloat (hopefully), I look at it as a way to stretch out the food I have at home.

Shortly before Colorado's lock-down (which includes restaurants, except for takeout / delivery), I unfortunately watched the movie Mr. Jones, which has some horrifying scenes about the 1930s famine in Ukraine.
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Mar 25, 2020 6:52 PM # 
Cristina:
That's true about the food at home and we are trying to minimize trips to the grocery. Certainly way more chance for close interactions at the supermarkets than at an empty restaurant. Of course, we are very well stocked with food, it's really milk, bread, and bananas that bring us to the store every couple of days. Our local TJ's has a limit of 2 of any item, and 2 containers of milk does not last long in this house!

I think I will hold off on watching Mr. Jones until this is all over. If there are still movies then.
Mar 25, 2020 11:38 PM # 
jjcote:
You can order a replacement watch charger. The one I bought (for peanuts on ebay) when mine got flaky is better than the original one.
Mar 25, 2020 11:51 PM # 
Cristina:
Oh, I found it! It was plugged into the same multi-adapter as it always is but that had moved into a different room and the cable was mostly hidden behind my trumpet case.
Mar 26, 2020 12:20 AM # 
yurets:
7 million people starved to death in America during the Great Depression. Those were brutal times.
Mar 27, 2020 9:20 PM # 
j-man:
How many people starved to death in Ukraine in the 1930s because of your friend Stalin?
Mar 27, 2020 9:31 PM # 
j-man:
OK, I'll help you out yurets... perhaps 0.35% of the world's population. Impressive result for somewhat misguided industrial policies.
Mar 27, 2020 11:57 PM # 
yurets:
j-man, industrialization was necessary, in fact critical, as WW2 was inevitable. The enemy had reputation of undefeatable. Armies of formally similar strength (France, Poland) were overrun in a matter of a few weeks. Brits ran in panic @Dunkirk.

The S.U. was able to defeat Nazis (in fact EU ver1.0) only by producing HUGE number of tanks (T-34), planes (IL-2), etc. American help was negligible.

Switching to collective farming was essential to increase productivity in agriculture.
Selling grain was the only way to get money to buy equipment for the new industrial projects. It was a strategic resource.

In fact that year was bad everywhere, in Volga region, Don region, the Ukraine.
BS about genocide is just a small piece of info-war (MH-17, Katyn', WADA, GULAG-NKVD horrors, etc., etc.)

The skinny socialist in the WH de-industrialized the US, the results are very visible already. How many thousands (millions) will die from inability to produce enough masks, protective cloths, medical equipment, ventilators for ICUs?
Mar 28, 2020 12:23 AM # 
j-man:
Wow, this is the most interesting thing I’ve seen on AP in years. I’d love to engage on this, but I will demur before jrorranc or some other scold rightly chastises me. But, mostly out of respect for Cristina.

I like your spunk and iconoclasm, yurets.
Mar 28, 2020 2:09 AM # 
jjcote:
I've never seen USSR abbreviated as S.U. before.
Mar 28, 2020 2:37 AM # 
blairtrewin:
Oddly enough, FSU (for former Soviet Union) is an acronym you'll sometimes find in climatological/meteorological literature (although less so than a decade or two ago) - but then I think we're also the only people who refer to the islands (mostly Indonesian) of southeast Asia as the "maritime continent".
Mar 28, 2020 5:48 AM # 
jtorranc:
@j-man I don't know precisely what the latest thinking is but your figure of 0.35% of world population at the time is slightly less than half of the number Robert Conquest settled on in Harvest of Sorrow, which I understand is now commonly criticized as an understatement (after decades of being mostly criticized as an overstatement). So I'm going to seize a rare chance to scold you for a radically different reason than usual - you should stop downplaying Stalin's crimes.
Mar 28, 2020 11:09 AM # 
j-man:
As an aside, Robert Conquest would be a great nom de plume for a historian. I guess some things were just meant to be.
Mar 28, 2020 5:13 PM # 
jtorranc:
I regretfully retract my scold - I presume my memory of reading of recent criticism of Conquest for understating the death toll was accurate but a modicum of additional research indicates it is nowhere near representative of the mainstream of thought on the question among historians. 0.35% is apparently towards the high end of the current range of estimates. Not to rubbish Conquest - some of the differences may be due to counting just the famine of 1932-32 versus the whole process of collectivization from 1928-33, plus of course he was writing a long time ago with less access to Soviet archives than more recent historians.
Mar 29, 2020 1:27 AM # 
yurets:
j-man, difficult times require appropriate actions, to save the healthy majority one needs to get rid of a few bad apples. Just announce anyone caught stockpiling would be prosecuted.
During Stalin days, a few hoarders would be publicly hanged, televised by the state TV, with huge signs: "He bought all the toilet paper. He won't need that much", "She was reselling hand sanitizer on e-bay", etc

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