Discussion: Naked Orienteering

Salomon XA Pro 3D Ultra 2 GTX Trail Gore-tex are discounted to 104 USD at REI.

I wanted some Goretex trail shoes for winter and these seem like a good deal.

http://www.rei.com/product/818510/salomon-xa-pro-3...

Love those for long trail runs and rogaines.

+1. Highly recommended for rogaining. 19+ hours of swampwalking in Estonia and zero blisters!

I've worn XA Pros since 2005 and they're still my go to shoe for long distance, off-trail sessions. Highly, highly recommend as they fit so well for most people right out of the box.

Agreed.

Yes, they are good shoes. I have worn the non-gore-tex version for several years now. I love the fit, stability and durability. The kevlar laces are reliable and easy to untie or adjust when wet. I hope the gore-tex version will give me all of those features, plus warmth.

I have Salomon shoes w/ GoreTex that I bought about 3 years ago. I have no idea what the model is -- doesn't say anywhere on the shoes.

Thanks for the heads up. I cleaned out my old shoes last weekend (a shoe donation bin at the Busa Bushwhack) and realized I don't have any heavier winter shoes at the moment. So off to REI to try these out... Fit felt pretty comfortable, even with neoprene socks in them so I grabbed a pair. Had a $100 gift card sitting around so that makes $145 pair of shoes that I would not have otherwise tried come out to $11. Sweet.... :-)

I have an athletic shoe collection to rival Imelda Marcos but XA Pros are my security blanket. I usually pull them out for adventure races, long treks or when I'm recovering from an injury. They fit me well and by now, I've tested them in most conditions. Goretex for winter and non-Goretex the rest of the time.

Speaking of the shoe collection, orienteers may be interested in my latest addition - the newly released Salomon Spikecross. It's hard to get lightweight IceBugs in Canada and I don't like traditional O shoes. So far I'm liking the grip a lot.

can you get traditional O shoes in Canada? ;-)

the Salomon SpikeCross was the official shoe of this year's Salomon Dongetlost Raid the Hammer. Bash won masters wearing the official shoe and Feet won overall wearing the SpikeCross.

And a quick review by Feet can be found here...

http://www.attackpoint.org/discussionthread.jsp/me...

For what it's worth, Gary will ship Icebugs to Canada. Plus there's the Canadian rep in Montreal who's name I forgot.

Are SpikeCross anything like the Goretex shoes Salomon makes? I know it's ClimaShield, not Goretex, but is it similar?

I never use waterproof shoes because I'm a very sweaty gal, and I need summer-time-like breathability even when it's -20. ;)

I'm very close to online-ordering Inov-8 Orocs, but if the SpikeCross are not waterproofed, I'd prefer to buy a locally-available shoe.

p.s. I need them for icy Thomass events.

I recently got Salomon Speed Cross and ran a trail marathon in them , they were great.
Got them at Backcountry.com for $58, with an online coupon.
Orocs have been on sale at The Clymb a few months ago, around $55.
I would rate the Salomon more comfortable.

I've got a pair of both the Inov-8 O-Roc 280's and Salomon SpikeCross, though I've only been using the SpikeCross since June. The Inov-8's are lighter and don't absorb much water. The Salomons are more comfortable and, in my opinion, grippier.

As far as waterproofing, the Salomons have waterproof fabric around the front and sides, but not around the back/heel. I did get caught in a mountain thunderstorm wearing the Salomons, and they did get pretty squishy when wet. Some of that is due to the insole, which is very spongelike. I need to find a new insole, or just remove it altogether.

The Inov-8's are designed to be orienteering shoes. The Salomons are designed to be super grippy winter trail runners.

The Salomons rock. I have had several pairs of Speed Crosses, and my current pair is GoreTexed. I swear by those (and my 280s--I just introduced a third pair of those into the rotation... I couldn't bear to throw out the pair they were supposed to replace.)

I notice you mention "icy".
You have to have metal dobs/spikes for ice, nothing else will come close.
Not sure if Salomon has a spiked shoe, but Inov-8 and Icebug surely do.
I did some shoe testing many years ago, part of the loop was on a hard snow pack with ice spots. Only spiked O' shoes inspired confident footing.

There are 3 models of Salomons on the same chassis/outsole:
SpeedCross (no spikes, not waterproof)
SpeedCross CS (no spikes, waterproof)
SpikeCross CS (spikes, waterproof)

Thanks guys, I think I'll have to go with the Inov-8, as my feet need to breathe.
Although not sure what is meant by "orienteering shoes" - what makes them so?

When I think "orienteering shoe", I think of a shoe with low heel/toe drop, metal dobbs (aka "spikes"), and a durable fabric that doesn't retain much water. The Inov-8's were primarily designed for orienteering (running over rocks, logs, whatever). Whereas the Salomon "spikes" were primarily designed for running over ice (ie a winter trail running shoe).

Comparing the two, the soles/spikes are similar, but the uppers are not.

Okay :) - I guess I don't know much shoe lingo - still never understand what drop is, haha.
I need these for a winter orienteering series, as last year I was sliding around on icy trails and lost a lot of time. So I need a combination of what you describe. But if the spikes are similar in both shoes anyway, then I'd opt for the breathable o-shoe instead.

I started using SpikeCross shoes for orienteering shortly before last year's Salomon Raid The Hammer and used them throughout the winter for orienteering and trail running. The spikes worked well in the same conditions where my IceBugs would have worked but when the "Palgrave Glacier" appeared for a little while, I added Kahtoola Microspikes for crampon-like grip.

I had the same concerns about the Climashield protection and overly warm feet but it isn't applied to all parts of the shoe so it's more breathable than a typical "Goretex running shoe". I continued to use them for orienteering when the weather warmed up but I have since switched to the new FellCross - at least until the snow comes. Similar fit, aggressive tread but no metal spikes, lighter and lower to the ground. 'Bent used his FellCross for the 50K Run for the Toad. FunRun and Solo run in them too. I'll probably switch back to the SpikeCross in winter though.

Here's what iRunFar said about the SpikeCross and the waterproofing.
http://www.irunfar.com/store/salomon-spikecross-3-...

Aggosst, since you wrote "I never use waterproof shoes because I'm a very sweaty gal, and I need summer-time-like breathability even when it's -20. ;)" then I think the Inov8 Orocs are a good choice! I also have very hot and sweaty feet (is that sexy?) and have found the Oroc 280s to be great winter shoes for me.

When running through snow, your feet are gonna get wet no matter what kind of "waterproofing" you have.

A "waterproof" layer like Gore Tex does help hold in the warmth when your feet are wet, and at -20 that is nice to have.

Hmm... Bash, thanks for the article/review. It's hard to tell from the photo how much is ClimaShielded. I'll ask at the store and report back.
Crisitina, sweaty, steamy feet are so sexy! (I keep telling myself.) Yes, my feet actually let off steam in the winter, hence the need for major ventilation, LOL.
LeMachine, I totally agree - for my case I don't see the point of so-called waterproofing - and once you get wet, you stay that way!

Better to go with wool socks if your feet sweat that much

My feet steam in the winter, too! Yay, I'm not alone!

My feet are sweating right now just thinking about wool socks. ;-)

If anyone ever needs a question answered about Salomon shoes, just put a comment on Phatty's log. Aggosst, I think you know Pete from orienteering meets. He recently moved from Canada to France to become Salomon's Global Footwear Manager. Or send him a link to this AP thread and ask him to comment here so others can see. He follows the Adventure Racing discussions but isn't over on the Orienteering forum that often. Phatty knows more details about footwear than any retailer, plus he can tell you if a different version of a shoe is coming out soon.

Re waterproofing and wet feet: As LeMachine says, the one time I definitely prefer waterproof shoes is when I snowshoe. My feet are going to be wet regardless but I retain some body heat that way.

Just quickly to clarify what CLIMASHIELD is and how you can see it in the different models it's put into. The membrane is purposefully placed in the forefoot and in the tongue but NOT in the rear part of the shoe (you can see where it's placed by looking inside and seeing orange lining...eg. the membrane that keeps the water out only exists in these parts). This was done to create sort of like a smart skin - eg. put the tech where you need it. In short, you're going to get wet anyway when running in wet conditions. For example, your feet sweat a lot as you're moving fast and water pours over the top and into the shoe as you move across sloppy ground. So, what matters most is how fast the shoe dries, how comfortable your foot feels, and how heavy the shoe's "wet weight" is. CLIMASHIELD construction is NOT waterproof but the idea is that your foot actually stays more comfortable and drier than if you used a full bootie membrane (eg. a membrane that is over the entire shoe). I did a snowshoe race a few years ago in shoes with a full bootie membrane and it was like running in bathtubs. My feet sweat a lot (and of course it was snowy conditions) and the bootie can only transport so much moisture out through the membrane. Since then, I only go for the CLIMASHIELD because my feet stay way more comfortable and surprisingly warmer. Hope that helps. While I'm loving living in the alps, I'm gutted that I'll be missing out on the THOMASS series this season!

> I did a snowshoe race a few years ago in shoes

Do you mean the Salomon Snowshoe Raid? As in race #2 in the Salomon Dontgetlost Adventure Running Series? :-)

As one of the race directors of the three races in the Salomon Dontgetlost Adventure Running Series I just wanted to take this opportunity to thank Salomon and Pete for their long time support. The orienteering and adventure racing community in southern Ontario has been very lucky to have Pete to talk to at races and training for advice on clothing and shoes and other outdoor gear. As Bash mentioned, Pete is now the Salomon's Global Footwear Manager! So I'm sure Pete is taking in comments and thoughts and feedback. Congratulations Pete on your new position in Salomon and if you do find yourself in southern Ontario this winter the Adventure Running Kids and Adventure Running X programs will be keeping the Caledon THOMASS race tradition continuing this winter!

Thanks Phatty! I did go in to the store tonight, but unfortunately the SpikeCross start at size 40, and that's too big for me - they are also too narrow for my foot.

Public Service Announcement: Salomon GTX shoes are still not, to the best of my knowledge, on sale - LOL - sorry to keep bringing this thread back to the top! :D

heh. this has gotten my hopes up at least four times now. i'm pretty sure the original poster - lemachine - can change the thread title if so inclined. if they go to edit the first post, it'll be a field they could edit.

i'd hate to miss when they actually go on sale, but i'm just sayin'.

edit: maybe. i can see the field, but the edit doesn't stick. but i'm no thread-authoring go-getter

Likewise. I'm a sucker for this thread.

Does Climashield count? Amazon currently has the Spikecross (with spikes and Climashield) for under $100, for sizes 6, 7, 8, 9-12.

Dang! I just bought these a month ago for full price!

I'm one of the reviewers--I really like them for orienteering in California.

Heh, my size is going fast. When I posted a few hours ago, there were at least 4 pairs in my size. Now there's just one. (I already have 2 pairs of these shoes, so I don't need a 3rd, haha.)

I was reading some of the reviews, and I came across this:

"They are great shoes but beware! The sole has a metal species which makes them difficult to walk with normal or smooth floors, I've been scratching the floor with bits of metal lol so I took them to a cobbler to have them removed and they were great!"

Classic!

"i'm pretty sure the original poster - lemachine - can change the thread title if so inclined. if they go to edit the first post, it'll be a field they could edit."

Title changed.
Long live the thread.

yes

well played

Dang, I barged into this thread hoping to learn more about naked orienteering! And all I got was my own complaints that SpikeCross don't fit me.

Well played indeed.

I don't know what this thread is about now.

I bought some Speedcross CS's from REI (so I could return them in case they didn't work out!)..

and I returned them.

I was totally enamored with many of the features, and they seemed PERFECT for rogaining.. but ultimately, they were too tall and stiff with no ground feel. I rolled my ankle HARD on a non-technical (totally flat!) stretch of trail.

BUT, this coming from someone whose running shoe collection doesn't exceed 6mm of drop. If you're used to "traditional" drop, it won't be an issue.

Now I'm going to try Inov8's Trailroc 255's instead.

Where is the naked? I am not seeing enough nakedness.

"Orienteering is probably the dullest sport invented by man..."

I'm sure that when you're in the military, it's a lot more fun than burying logs.

Cristina's post was shockingly aprapos. Well played.