Register | Login
Attackpoint - performance and training tools for orienteering athletes

Discussion: Dave Lamb missed two contro...

in: bgallup; bgallup > 2012-12-08

Dec 9, 2012 2:21 AM # 
Dave Lamb missed two controls, I'm pretty sure.
Dec 9, 2012 3:23 AM # 
No fooling? I got the impression we tied them. We intentionally skipped one, and the track looks like we hit all the other ones. If you're right, either we mispunched and/or didn't get credited, or they got a bonus control. I remember being briefly confused when the mentioned our/dave's point totals and thinking it was one too low, but I was pretty interested in the business end of a pizza slice at the moment. Curious!
Dec 9, 2012 3:31 AM # 
They had trouble with 14 and skipped it and I believe they also missed 23.
Dec 9, 2012 4:09 AM # 
well i'll be.... mispunch, scoring error, or a criminal Untamed NE conflict of interest made real?
Dec 9, 2012 4:24 AM # 
scoring error
Dec 9, 2012 4:31 AM # 
He told me they couldn't find 14, and then skipped another, i.e. what Joe said. And said it was a pain knowing they weren't going to get them all, cut motivation some.
Dec 9, 2012 4:35 AM # 
we were the first ones to 14 and it was flat on the ground under a tree. I hung it on a branch on the north side of the leaning tree it was on. it appeared to have a lock on it, but not locked to the tree.
Dec 9, 2012 5:30 AM # 
thanks for that, by the way - did everyone a solid favor there. we (mistakenly) went to 13 first, and got a good view of the conga line behind you on our way to 12. pretty sure (but not 100%) we save dave there, which means the flag would've been up while he was looking. i wouldn't make any claim to second if he was prowling for a flattened flag.

also, i think that 'we don't think anyone is going to clear the map' is just something race organizers are obligated to say. taunting the masochists must be fun.
Dec 9, 2012 1:04 PM # 
We came to #14 from #16 missed slightly on the east leaving the flat marshy area and got up within view of the stream bend S of the control before realizing the issue, but moving fast at this point so not more than 2 min lost. From #14 we headed to #15 and north.
Dec 9, 2012 5:22 PM # 
Quick as we have holiday party all day & won't post results until later tonight: I know Lamb et al missed 2 pts & official results will reflect this. Now unplug, go outside everyone as its beautiful out!
Dec 9, 2012 6:29 PM # 
Heh, no worries at all Grant, it's just trivia. But if it were something between us and Joe, it might be different. Much more importantly, thanks for putting on a kickass event - hope it went well on your end, and I definitely hope that you do another one. For an allegedly low-frills event, the race was a ton of fun and the pizza fest afterwards was perfect. Well done!

also, Dave said I should tell you about the CSU urban race in boston - I suspect it'll be similar in scale. I'll definitely be telling them about yours, you set a great example. Might see you at your Pawtuckaway event if the (Fin') deer flies are less than two inches across. Expect to see people with blue tape on their hats.
Dec 9, 2012 7:19 PM # 
Dec 9, 2012 10:36 PM # 
ha! thanks clint! ian's working pretty hard there. an executive role to be sure.

my favorite part was pretending that working the pump was like CPR, and telling the tent not to give up on me, god damn it. that might've been fatigue talking.

also, way to work the camera, clint!
Dec 9, 2012 11:36 PM # 
did you pump with your hand or foot? I used my foot.
Dec 10, 2012 12:12 AM # 
hands. already kneeling and too lazy to stand up
Dec 10, 2012 1:31 AM # 
I had the same thoughts about Ian's executive prowess, but decided to refrain from snarkey comments. :-)

I tried kneeling and had a hard hamstring siezure, had to stand and bend to connect the pump - and definitely used foot. You guys must have really flown because we arrived together and you were long gone when we finished and I don't think we took very long....
Dec 10, 2012 1:40 AM # 
Joe was even faster. Based on Forerunner tracks, Ian/Ben were just under 10 minutes (from entering to leaving building), Joe/Jeff under 9, and I was 15+. :-(
Dec 10, 2012 1:41 AM # 
we ran the stairs both ways. I pumped while jeff strapped down the guys to the carpet stakes.
Dec 10, 2012 2:29 AM # 
Dover Raid results and checkpoint details are posted to We'll circulate these via a final email to all competitors tomorrow..

Breaking news . . . after confirming with Dave Lamb after he looked over the great "Frankenmap" and other route details posted online, and my validation of his team's passport . . . they DID indeed obtain CP #14 (which is why we announced their point total as 61 at the post-race honours, despite his telling me verbally that they missed 14 and another checkpoint -- they had 14 punched properly on their passport and we cranked through all the passports at the close of the race without giving his passport any special attention).

I think Dave is not active on AP, so you may want to go to him for the full explanation, but he summarized for me a combination where they pushed hard to #14 and beyond it en route to picking up #15 and then between wet map cases, a division of labour on their team where Chad carries the passport and does the actual punching while Dave owns the maps, and Dave's confusion of #13 with #14 during scans of their map after a couple re-foldings, had him confusing the next checkpoint they needed to visit as #14 instead #16 and so they ended up attacking #14 (a second time) after obtaining #15. They didn't find #14 this time (adding credence to the statement that they were slightly disoriented during some post cp #15 moments) and eventually moved on to #16 and then continued racing.

Just as overkill, here is the passport for Dave's team showing #14 clearly punched correctly:

Thankfully for me, as I'm sure critics would claim favoritism for Dave and his team of Untamed NE athletes (who I train with and am good friends with), this has ZERO IMPACT on the final results. Dave and his team finished 7 minutes behind the Gallup duo to claim 3rd place overall, but they did genuinely finish with 61 points and only missed a single CP. The 4th place finisher was duo P Benoit and J Shultis (team The Young and the Rested) and they finished with 56 points.

My main takeaway here is that we at Untamed need to more aggressively adopt e-punching (SI or Emit or our own RFID concept) so that time at the finish line can be spent drinking beers and talking with the racers more than studying muddy (esp team #29!) passports -- a quick printout showing Dave his team's visit and timestamp to CP #14 would have brought this all to light quickly last evening.

Regardless, thanks everyone and look for more from us soon!
Dec 10, 2012 2:47 AM # 
Hey, Grant, just want to say it was a great event. I thoroughly enjoyed it.
Dec 10, 2012 3:12 AM # 
That team 29 sounds mighty irresponsible. I'm sure it was just mud on ourtheir passport, though. I hope. And no one would ever claim favoritism, just insinuate it.

Also, I don't want to short Ian his share of the credit for "Gallup Duo" Sink, Trip, Crash - we decided to team up at the last second and it looks like the naming protocol goes for the goofier name and/or the louder mouth.

and clint - i had actually borrowed a prototype of one of their tents five or so years ago. not recent enough to know their current valving/pumping scheme, but enough to know inflatable shenanigans are their theme. helped, somewhat. and we ran up the stairs like joe - just slower.
Dec 10, 2012 12:03 PM # 
I took the pump out and immediately realized there were no poles, but it took me a good minute to find where the damn valve was, then trying to fish my hand through the tiny zipper hole before realizing I could just open the door to the tent. And then another half minute to realize there was a second inflatable arch. I'd heard of these tents, but never seen one in practice so it was new to us...
Aug 4, 2020 1:05 AM # 
Revisiting this discussion - why is my name only mentioned in the list of individual mistakes? In contrast, my entry begins "Dover Raid with bgallup."


Please login to add a message.