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Discussion: What is the value of joining a local orienteering club?

in: Orienteering; General

Sep 28, 2010 7:23 PM # 
RJM:
Although participation in our local events (North Eastern Ohio O club, Ohio USA) has held pretty steady for over a decade, our paying membership has decreased noticeably in the recent past (~2-5 years). This hurts finances and volunteerism.
The major changes I’ve seen in that time that might explain this have been:

1) Cessation of a paper newsletter – all club info is now via email and website, and both are readily available to both members and non-members.

2) Lax membership checks at signin (members get a $3 price break on the $8 entry fee at a local meet).

Our thought is that most participants don’t recognize any real value to membership, and may not even realize that membership is a possibility.

We are looking at what sort of ‘value added’ changes we might institute so that participants would become members and volunteers. What suggestions and experiences do you have on this?”

(If your suggestion includes hosting social events, please be specific about what has worked for you, because social events have been real yawns for us. There is virtually no interest. Our orienteers seem to like to be alone in the woods.)
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Sep 28, 2010 7:34 PM # 
c.hill:
Reasons why I am a member of CNOC.
1. Friends are in the club, all of my family are in the club,the social aspect - meet up for trainings, discuss general O, take part in hill running as a team, bit of banter, competitive- I want to be on the first relay team, but so do 5 other guys! It gives me a team to run on at the relays (both O and hill running).

All of my friends are in the club. I have a club top to ware. The club top marks me out as a CNOC member. I am a CNOC member, therefore I am not a member of....CorkO or worse LVO. I feel ill even typing that...

If i wasn't a member of CNOC I would be a lost soul pretending that I want to be a member of some distant scandi club.

I have access to my clubs collection of maps/ocad files to plan trainings.
The club provide funding to international competitions where I represent the Irish Team.

I see no reason why I should not be a member of CNOC!
Sep 28, 2010 8:36 PM # 
Cristina:
Value added ideas:

1. Express registration for members. Have a current list of members printed out and placed in a binder with a "sign here" for the waiver and a "check here" for course option. Then you just need a container for $. No issues with people taking the member discount without a current membership since they won't be on the list. Alternatively, they could be on the list with a "Renew now!" option. We sometimes do this at our meets, but not consistently.

2. Offer the use of maps (a digital copy) for individual or small group training for free for members only.

3. Hold a members-only meet, or members-only training events. Perhaps making it a novelty event, like cell-phone orienteering, would increase the members-only aspect.
Sep 28, 2010 8:59 PM # 
iriharding:
at MNOC we do members only events (at least two per year) to reinforce the value of being a member (no membership of an O club then you can't register for the event) .

One members only meet is an O meet with lots of mixing up of participants ( mass start 45 min score o, followed by mass start team relay or 2 - 3 family friendly sprints ( 1 km course, micro O/kids course, maze O or blindfold ) or similar.

We also make night O's typically members only meets so as to limit the issues of folks getting hurt and/or really lost .
Sep 28, 2010 9:06 PM # 
j-man:
The value of a membership is a question OUSA and local clubs get often.

In DVOA there are several benefits to membership:

• Cheaper event registration
• The high quality (but not always timely) paper newsletter
• Access to the online community (a la AP) and pretty nice results and rankings capability.

If you are an infrequent participant, those probably won't be too valuable.

An intangible benefit of a a club is the social aspect. If you can foster a sense of community, then "buying in" to the club makes sense.

Another consideration--I think membership should be made extremely easy. Akin to using drivers' licenses as an alternative to nettlesome voter registration. I think orienteering memberships can work the same way... or, rather, should be made comparably easy.

I find filling out paper and stamps and checks very annoying. If I can click a few times, I'm going to be much more likely to join, all things equal. Just from overcoming inertia.
Sep 28, 2010 9:25 PM # 
dlevine:
Other benefits:

Email notification of events, etc.
Club picnics/dinners with short (30-minute or less) little events (line-O, poker-O) attached to them.
Chance to win club recognition awards (cheap, but everyone likes a pat on the back)
Feeling of belonging with the group after events.

(Note that the latter will definitely not affect members who joined and lapsed; the former three are pretty small benefits, but the ones listed above, e.g. reduced fees/newsletter/etc., also apply.
Sep 28, 2010 10:05 PM # 
Louise:
we've just done a run of high-quality club polo shirts, free to club members (one per household). We've also just had a rush on membership renewals...
Sep 28, 2010 10:34 PM # 
Greig:
Membership to my club gives you several benefits.
Cheaper event fees, generally non members pay about 50% more to enter so if you run 5-6 events a year then it's cheaper to join.
To enter regional/national events there is an extra charge if you aren't a member.
Newsletter once a month.
Very cheap training during the week if you are a member. This is organised by the elite orienteers mainly and the cost is just to cover the printing of the map.
Emails of up coming events.
Ability to purchase a club orienteering top.
Can't represent NZ unless you are a club member, not really an issue except for a few elites.
Sep 28, 2010 10:41 PM # 
bl:
All of the above; some clubs have the "magic combination", the "spark", the "critical mass" - others don't and (likely) won't.
Sep 29, 2010 2:05 AM # 
Vector:
Yep, a lot of the abobe stated benefits I also hae enjoyed for club membership. Here's some that might not be very obvious but I have personally also enjoyed:

- Carpools and other arrangements with other club members for going to meets
- Increased training opportunities... club members have more opportunities to orienteer because they can help w/ the field checking, course design, course vetting, etc... In my case, even when I can't make it to a meet, I often am able to partcipate as a member of the club in preparing the event which is also excellent orienteering experience
- Maybe you'll laugh at this one, but its another thing you can put on your own bio or resume that shows you are not a boring person (...although I'm not promising anything about not coming off as a geek!!)
- Perhaps most important of all is this --> If you like orienteering, you will be able to like it more if you support your local club both financially and voluntarily. In other words, if you pay the club membership money, chances are that you will get better services in return. Perhaps that means better equipment, e-punch system capability, uniform, better food for after the race, a better social, etc... who knows. In order to have orienteering events, you have to have these clubs, and in order for these clubs to function, you have to have financial support.... so as I see it, the main benefit for paying membership is that orienteering exists in my local area.
Sep 29, 2010 3:05 AM # 
AliS:
We make everyone who comes out sign up as a member - basically to get numbers for funding. It's cheap - $5 for new members and $10 for renews. This gets you free weekly training events (in parks with pin flags) and free juice and cookies at weekly events. We don't make money through our membership; our money is made at our bigger weekend events.
Sep 29, 2010 3:05 AM # 
Rosstopher:
I really like the BOK method where membership rates are a little higher but local meets are free. No more carrying money.

Something that we'd like to do in the Boston area ... but time and volunteers are needed... a junior development program.

A good website could have perks for members only, results for all comers but splits for members only?? that seems a little contrived though.

I don't know how I feel about denying services to non-members (services that you'd otherwise offer to all) just to make membership more enticing. We don't have a large membership, and our coffers may be smaller for it, but we make do on the proceeds from putting on local meets and occasionally an A meet.
Sep 29, 2010 4:25 AM # 
chitownclark:
Let's face it: most non-profits urge people to become "members" to induce regular donations. And I've become a member of more than 100 worthwhile organizations and clubs over the years...all of which do good work and encourage participation.

But looking back, my local Chicago orienteering club has been THE BEST membership of all. Because unlike those other organizations, I was actively called by club members, invited to help out, travel to A-meets, etc. I immediately felt both included and needed in a personal manner...and very quickly was given significant responsibilities. I was thrilled.

IMO the charm of orienteering club membership is more than a financial equation. If done properly, being a member fills an intangible need that most of us have in our daily lives.

Employees of the best companies sometimes claim they'd do their jobs for free. This is because their company has made their jobs seem essential, important and rewarding. A well-run orienteering club provides its members that same intangible sense of fulfillment. That gratification can be much more important to most of us than a newsletter or saving $5 on a few local meets.
Sep 29, 2010 6:28 PM # 
jtorranc:
Critical mass is certainly important. If NEOOC were a large club with many more events in their schedule annually, it would be easier for people to come to enough events for being a member to be cheaper than not being a member. If NEOOC local events drew more participants, there would probably be lengthy lines at registration and a streamlined members-only registration process might be a significant enticement. Absent the resources to offer more cool training/social activities/other enticements to join or to put on many more events and/or draw more participants to those events, I see little choice for NEOOC but to raise the price for non-members to a level at which it makes financial sense for occasional orienteers to join. It's not as though it would take much - just raising the non-member fee to $10 would move the break event point from 5 events per year to 3 events per year. Plus it would be easier to make change at registration.
Sep 29, 2010 6:31 PM # 
j-man:
I agree.

But, on a related note... something that amazes me, especially in Massachusetts, is the number of people that do not have the toll transponders. The lines for cash pay seem inordinately long. I would think that people would look at the potential time savings, and get one. But, it seems many people do not.
Sep 29, 2010 6:31 PM # 
Hammer:
I wonder what the response would be if the word orienteering in the title of this thread was changed to triathlon or trail running? Orienteering clubs tend to focus on hosting events while other sports tend to focus on social activities and developing athletes of all ages.
Sep 29, 2010 7:02 PM # 
c.hill:
mountain running in ireland.
Pay your €10 reg free and €7 race fee. Every race then costs €7.

Everyone has a race number that they collect at the start which results in a great database of photos and race results.

www.imra.ie (great website is well)
Sep 29, 2010 7:06 PM # 
jtorranc:
"Your club must be lame. Maybe you ought to disband and encourage your members to join some other ________ club."?
Sep 29, 2010 11:20 PM # 
mouse136:
if you join a club are you insured under their insurance policy if you get injured? or is it a enter at your own risk deal?
Sep 30, 2010 1:20 AM # 
randy:
Our thought is that most participants don’t recognize any real value to membership,

I agree, what is the value to membership? The opportunity to volunteer? Most people, in the normal course of their existence, are bombarded by so many opportunities to volunteer for this or that worthy cause that their time doing so is already maxed to capacity.

I would echo some of the thoughts above -- make it feel more like a "club", and less like your purpose is to be a warm body on the volunteer list. For example, lets say someone has been an active member for over a decade, including doing their share of volunteering, and all the sudden they stop. In a normal club environment (say a letterboxing or metal detecting club, for example), at least one person would reach out to them and see if everything is ok. That's what I mean in suggesting -- make it feel like an actual club. If the only communication they get from the club, say, after 9 months, is the continued barrage of: volunteer for this, volunteer for that, I'm guessing that that experience will start to wear thin after a while, but WDIK? The best way to sum that up is: make it feel like a mutual enterprise, not a one way deal. I think this could apply to USOF as well. People who feel a sense of mutualism may be more likely to volunteer as well.

Now, as to the discount "benefit", I'm not sure I see this is a benefit at all. This is simple retailing -- "prepay and save". "Buy X, get a discount on X+Y". "Pay a loan origination fee up front, and you get a discount on your mortgage rate". No matter how it is presented, that's what it is. Most rational people will go for this stuff if it is a good deal for them. We all know that. But, I think to call it a benefit is misleading. By that, I mean, it is not a reason to become a member, but a rational consumer decision. In this case, I feel the reason is important. Has anything really been gained if your entire warm body list (and this is always the prime (and sometimes only) reason given to try to jack up the body count), is made up of people who's sole motivation is rational consumer finance? Put another way, it is not a benefit because nothing is being given or received; all one is doing is pre-paying for goods and services when it is rational to do so.

So, where does this leave us? If there aren't any benefits, perhaps there shouldn't be a cost, either. I think the easiest way to jack up the body count is to make the club membership free. Run three races, and you become a member (assuming you opt in), at no cost. Leaving aside the reason a high body count is desirable for now, I would argue that this is the best way to achieve it. If no capital benefits are being bestowed on a per member basis (e.g. print newsletters, not discounts, per above), why is the per member cost north of $20? I would argue that the lion's share of a club's operational expenses are a result of conducting races, not member services and capital member benefits, thus the cost should be borne there as well. Moreover, it is generally the present members that want (and presumably would benefit by the jacked up volunteer list), and thus they should bear the cost of building it, not the new member.

At the end of the day, everyone is still going to want some sort of real benefit, or they are not going to do it unless it is free. They are not going to pay for the privilege of being pestered to volunteer as the only communication. In the era of virtual everything, I'm guessing material benefits such as print newsletters aren't all that exciting (they certainly aren't financially efficient for their producers, notwithstanding the fact that money-strapped organizations continue to produce them). As Clark articulated so well, being given a purpose is a nice benefit. Friendship, a sense of community, camaraderie, mutualism, a sense of the club doing something important and useful in the community, are all nice benefits. "Members Only"; I can't get excited about that -- not only does it sound cliquish, but it is back to a consumer financial decision -- is that Member's Only product worth the cost of membership? I don't think you are building community with that, only providing a cold, hard incentive.

Finally, I don't think it is unreasonable to accept or admit that there really is no point to membership. Make it up on race fees, and pay people to do the otherwise volunteer tasks. If the sole motivation for body count is a volunteer pool, I'm sorry, but I can't sympathize with that. Give them a product or community they want to be a part of, and it will take care of itself.

HTH, and apologies for the length.
Sep 30, 2010 3:01 AM # 
fossil:
something that amazes me, especially in Massachusetts, is the number of people that do not have the toll transponders. The lines for cash pay seem inordinately long.

Heh. We got ours shortly after the kids were born. After about the 2nd time we noticed that rolling down the window to pay a toll would let in either enough cold air or noise to wake them up and shatter the peacefulness of a nice long drive. Parents of twins will do just about anything for a little peace and quiet! ;-)
Sep 30, 2010 8:44 AM # 
IanW:
I think Randy and hammer have got it right when it comes to orienteering "clubs" - if you looked it up in the dictionary I reckon you'd see the following for the majority of UK and US "clubs":

Orienteering club: Group of volunteers who collectively organise events for others.

What other sports club works like this? Why is the setup in the UK/US like this, in contrast to Scandinavia where a club acts like a club?

Why do people join a club? As Colm has hinted at - to meet others/the social aspect, to gain access to coaching, to improve in their sport, to gain regular opportunities to train/participate/practice with like-minded people. There shouldn't be the need for arbitrary "benefits" like a newsletter or event email to join - people should want to do so because it offers them what they want from a club.

We're not very good at that though - so how do we change things?
Sep 30, 2010 11:12 AM # 
toddp:
I like group training for orienteering but my club does not offer that. Perhaps because of insurance/liability issues. I am not sure. Seems like training opportunities should go hand in hand with membership in a club. From my reading, it seems like European clubs offer many training opportunities for their members.
Sep 30, 2010 12:23 PM # 
j-man:
I think IanW and danf hit upon where the problem lies, although I'm not sure danf's solution, in the context of DVOA at least, would work.

The orienteering "business model" is broken. Many smart people have weighed in on this. Vladimir has had a lot of good things to say in the past, so maybe he'll show up here... But, variations of this lament are heard with great frequency. I'm not sure there is much to add.

Anyway, you have something called a club which offers some benefits to "members." Not everyone values those benefits; some would like others, etc... But, virtually all clubs implore their members to "volunteer." Randy contrasted this model with some other organizations that work more like clubs. But, I think that analogy only goes so far. The clubs he cites don't undertake complex and esoteric events as part of their raison d'etre. Orienteering is inherently all about that. Technical skill and infrastructure (i.e., maps and equipment, to a much lesser extent) are de rigeur. And we can talk about bare bones meets and all that, but at the end of the day, orienteers are demanding and seemingly more exacting and supercilious, on occasion, than peers in things like adventure racing. There is overlap between the concepts, but they are really different sports.

Anyway, I don't know any other place where you have something that is so skill and infrastructure dependent that is built on the backs of volunteers as a sustainable business model. (Open source software comes to mind, but I see more differences than similarities there.)

So, solution that many in the US identify is to become more like Sweden, where you have lots of clubs, so they share the load. True, but you also have more money, more visibility, more people and density. The idea of DVOA splitting up into a federation? It certainly wouldn't look like Sweden. In fact, it has already been done. Remember the Pocono Orienteering Club? SVO is also a spawn of DVOA, but after many years, not more than a single shoot (apologies to all my SVO friends.)

CSU is great, and a true club. Less balkanization than in DVOA, but if orienteering clubs are like elements, you can keep making them smaller and they have the same properties. CSU will have the same issues regarding burnout, even while undertaking fewer meets.

What is there to be done? Keep coming up with great ideas, and maybe an epiphany will strike. For my part, I have resigned myself to the situation, I think. Orienteering has some conceptual and structural issues, especially in an American social context, that in my mind preordain a certain burdensome organization model.

That said, smaller could be better for some, if the social aspect is what is sought. If a good product to the end consumer is desired, I think economies of scale are unavoidable, although the organizational model that supports them has its own limitations.
Sep 30, 2010 1:01 PM # 
sherpes:
my comments below apply to a small club, in fact, very similar to the club of the original poster of this thread.

I read the comments by Clark of Chicago, and it resonates alot with the experience of the folks that, spontaneously, sign up to become members. They don't do it for a tangible financial benefit, but rather for an intangible feeling of "connectness".

I disagree that raising meet fees for non-members will entice a participant to become member. Instead, it will do the opposite: entice them to not return. Why should a family pay $30 for a couple of starts for what they perceive to be a walk in the woods, when geocaching is free.

People want to feel busy and fill their schedule. Maybe they are already associated or members of, or quasi-de-facto-member to other groups, associations, clubs, societies, non-profits, etc etc. Another form to sign to be then told "you are now a member of... " doesn't attract them.

People are clicky: they like to socialize within a bubble and rarely cross the border. Adventure racers seem to know of, and travel to, events that are strictly AR, but then they don't know anything about the local club organizing a 6-hr rogaine in their own backyard (irony of this story is that the poster of this tread organized that rogaine).

In general aspect, I'll say it is a general trend, where the "club" model is something of the past, that people are disassociating themselves from, something that is well documented in the research book "Bowling Alone".
Sep 30, 2010 1:33 PM # 
ccsteve:
I wrote this piece for our club newsletter back in the spring...

Club Membership - What's in it for you?

My membership story if fairly simple - the first year I started orienteering I thought that the membership would be useful if I was going to get out to more than eight events. (Call me a simple mathematician here, but I realized saving $3 per event would pay for the single year family membership of $25 after eight events...) But the first time out, I didn't purchase it because I didn't know if I'd be back. The second and third times I was in a hurry and still wasn't convinced. The sixth time out I realized that I should have purchased the membership a few months back, but with only a few more events left in the year it didn't make sense to do so any longer!-)

The next season I purchased a three year family membership in the spring (that saved even more) and haven't really thought about it since...

But surely you're thinking there must be other reasons to become a member - let me pause for a minute...

* The club prefers volunteers to be club members - there may even be an insurance requirement behind it. [Ed - there is]
* When I volunteer, I skip the meet fee entirely - and I do that a half dozen times a year, so that saves another $18.
* The club has given out volunteer T-shirts over the last few years, and I've earned one of those - so there's more value.

Ok, that seems concentrated around volunteering at events, so let me offer a different perspective...

* Last year I joined the club's Board of Directors - again to help, but to get my voice heard. When we were planning the current season, I brought up the topic of a Canoe-O event because my kids really enjoyed one a few years back - and viola - there's a Canoe-O event in May!

But really - perhaps the biggest reason I joined and remain a member is because I happen to love orienteering. And long ago I learned that if you care about something, you've got to step up and support it - with your time and resources.

Compared to any other recreational or entertainment the family can find, Orienteering is relatively inexpensive, great exercise, mentally challenging, and a whole lot of fun. I think about those things and get passionate about helping people find the outdoors again.

And that's what you should think about too.

Thanks for listening!

steve
[And thinking about the concept of communicating with club members more, and then wanting to reach more and more of them, I'm liking the idea of auto-membership at some point and finding a different way to raise funds...]
Sep 30, 2010 2:19 PM # 
j-man:
I think an interesting, but maybe almost intractable corollary question is why some clubs are big, some small. While some thrive, some die.

True, there are secular trends as a backstory, but a lot of idiosyncratic variability.

Some may not want to be big. Some may not fully articulate a position on size. But, some, IMO, are going to remain small if they are too insistent on being "clubs" and hence, remain too inward looking. I felt that way about a certain club many years ago, and the trend there is clear. And, with some exceptions, both individually and corporately (like GHO I think) orienteers tend to be introverted or the equivalent. (This is a gut feeling, I don't have any data on this...)

Sure, you can have collections of introverts, but I'm not sure how they propagate.
Sep 30, 2010 6:53 PM # 
chitownclark:
....some [clubs] are going to remain small if they are too insistent on being "clubs" and hence, remain too inward looking....

I fully agree. USOF has provided very little guidance so far as what "success" means, in terms of (a) membership growth, (b) new mapping, or (c) A-meets presented. Club presidents are not challenged to attain any standards that I know of.

This was my initial suggestion to Glen Schorr when he took office last year, that he survey the successful clubs, using whatever parameters of "success" he might choose. And then attempt to provide "Secrets of Success" to ALL the clubs...a bit of cross-pollination that he's in a unique position to provide. And finally to challenge the clubs to set goals for these parameters that they'd agree to attain over the coming years.

In my opinion, such commitments to organic growth from within involving the clubs themselves, goes hand-in-hand with redesigning an appealing logo and OUSA's national "branding" campaign. Because if the local club presidents want to "remain small" what good is it to spend a lot of time and money publicizing orienteering nationally?
Sep 30, 2010 7:43 PM # 
bmay:
In my opinion the most sensible approach is:

1) Charge everyone (member or not) the same fee at events.*
2) Give everyone who wants one free membership in the "club".

You build a club (i.e., by making cost of entry free). You collect fees based on the thing that people feel has economic value (the events). The problem with charging for membership is that a lot of people do the math and don't see the economic benefit.

* Note: Quite separately from membership issues you could offer a "season pass"for those who know they will do a lot of events and want to jump the registration queue.
Oct 1, 2010 4:59 PM # 
Tundra/Desert:
Yes, I feel strongly about the chotchkes for volunteering thing (no cash involved). I volunteer regularly at trail races that do that; a token worth $50 in entry credit for 4 hours of my time (at minimum brain activity) feels like a fair deal. Lots and lots of others feel the same way, too—the for-profit trail races seem never short of volunteers (or attendance). There is no "membership", just friends. However, one long-time volunteer ended up with a chunk of the event company as a result.

I don't volunteer much for the local O-club anymore. The more I volunteer, the more I am expected to do, and there is no monetray break whatsoever. To me this does mean a lot. If I were independently wealthy, it wouldn't. I know most at the local O-club disagree with this point of view, so I won't argue further here in favor of the above model.
Oct 2, 2010 2:55 AM # 
mikeminium:
Two years ago my club started a winter school league and summer weeknight sprint series.

Starting the school league also increased the numbers of parents and young siblings who came out to do courses, increasing revenue.

Having local events more frequently increased the regularity of attendance ... lots of people came every week.

Since we started having more events, it seems like to has gotten easier to "throw together" an event on short notice. Especially when they are shorter (sprint or middle) courses like we use for the sprint series (sprints) and school league (typically middles).

Regarding J-man's comment about automated toll collection, I was ready to get one but was put off by all the nickle and dime fees - they charge you for the transponder, they take money before you use it (like a debit account rather than charging your credit card as you use), there was an inactivity fee if you went so long without using it, and I think a couple other fees. Plus it is supposedly tied to a particular license plate so it doesn't do you any good if you fly and rent a car. Maybe its worth it to everyday commuters, but to an occasional user like me, it seemed like a rip-off. I understand different states/agencies have different policies and charges. If you know a place to get an EZ pass that doesn't charge so d**n many extra fees (the one I originally looked at was thru PA Tpk), let me know by email & I'll take a look at it.
Oct 2, 2010 11:15 AM # 
feet:
Mike, you will get way too many emails unless someone posts an answer to your sidetrack question. Check out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-ZPass#Account_fees_...

I don't vouch for its total accuracy, but the fact that the NYS Thruway Authority doesn't charge any fees beyond the initial $25 deposit of pre-paid tolls I can vouch for. Looks like your best options are MA, NY, or VA, although in NY I'm not sure how an out-of-state account would be guaranteed to link to the Thruway Authority (no fees) rather than the Port Authority (monthly $1 fee).

I'd pick MA - the bad press about lines at tollbooths in MA the last few years means the continuing pressure to get people to sign up for FastLane (= EZPass) is more likely to keep it free for longer. Also, budget problems aren't as severe as NY...

It's totally worth it to me with an average of about two uses a month. The one time it saves you a lengthy queue, all the slight hassle of setting it up is paid for in one go.
Oct 2, 2010 12:04 PM # 
jjcote:
I live in MA, but got mine from NJ, because at the time they didn't charge a startup fee. They later instituted a $12/year fee, but I haven't been motivated to switch. Severl years later, the satisfaction that I get from going through the automated lanes still makes it completely worthwhile.

They may say that you aren't supposed to use it with the wrong license plate, but in practice I believe that people do this on a regular basis without problem (e.g. having one trasponder that they move between two cars). Shouldn't really matter, and I think the license plate only comes into play if you go through the tollboth without a working transponder.
Oct 2, 2010 1:23 PM # 
GuyO:
I got my E-ZPass long ago (mid 90s) through the Port Authority of NY/NJ. Since I use a credit card to "refill" my account, there is no deposit, nor did I have to pay for the tag -- at least I don't remember doing so. When they started charging a monthly $1 fee, I grumbled but didn't think it was worth the effort to shop around.

I think the OH Tpk has brought or will shortly be bringing E-ZPass online, so they might also be distributing and managing them. The IL Tollways and IN Toll Road already accept E-ZPass (but you probably already know that).
Oct 2, 2010 4:06 PM # 
bubo:
Orienteering clubs --> E-ZPass...

Another successful hijack of an AP thread ;)
Oct 2, 2010 5:46 PM # 
jima:
Unless you can use your EZ Pass transponder to pay local meet fees.
Go through the special sign in lane that recognizes your transponder, sign your waiver, grab a map, SI dibber into the start box, and you're off into the woods.

Somehow I don't see any clubs spending too much time researching if this woud be possible.
Oct 2, 2010 6:03 PM # 
bill_l:
Indeed, but not entirely irrelevant. Perhaps an indirect argument for club membership if membership includes pre-paid meet fees? Add the ability to pre-register.

If a map, clue sheet, punchcard or epunch we're waiting for me when I arrived at the event I'd be very happy and consider that a benefit of membership.
Oct 2, 2010 8:05 PM # 
Canadian:
The issue with that Bill, is that it is more work for the event organizers to do that. Given that orienteering event organizers are generally unpaid volunteers and that the volunteer base is pretty thin as it is... Effectively we all get what we pay for. For an event entry fee in the range of $5 or $10 as compared to $40 or $50 for races in some sports.. well we can't expect too much from our small and sometimes under-appreciated but dedicated group of volunteers.

Maybe the question should be: Why is there that cost discrepancy and why doesn't it match a similar discrepancy in meet turnout?

I think it comes down to the accessibility of the sport (and perhaps a bit of marketing ;) One of the things about running is that anyone can by a pair of running shoes and go for a run. There is therefore more runners and more people at running races. We need to ask ourselves are we trying to increase orienteering club membership or the number of orienteers? I'm pretty sure we all ultimately want the latter and the way to do this is to provide more opportunities to do the sport. There needs to be opportunities for people to train or practice or many people will become discouraged. Sadly, in NA anyway, most new orienteers are left to figure out the sport on there own - other than maybe a quick tutorial or two. There should be permanent courses out there to try on your own as well as more open training sessions open to and aimed at all levels of orienteer.
This kind of thing could be something only available to members if you're inclined to lean in that direction. Training would have to be on a regular basis (and need not be complicated) and then you end up building membership, community (important in for any serious club), and general interest in the sport.
Oct 2, 2010 10:05 PM # 
boyle:
permanent courses...why or why not?!?

This discussion thread is closed.